You have 4 children under 10 and a successful career only to find that your brain tumour has returned more aggressively. Your doctor tells you to prepare for death. The emotional roller coaster is unimaginable. Kate's incredible story brings hope, stability and humility to a precariously dangerous situation. For most of her life Kate was a 'giver' and 'receiving' didn't come easily. A brain tumour is a tough teacher.
Thank you to the Quest for Life foundation for assistance in this episode. If you need help or can volunteer or donate please visit their website: https://questforlife.org.au/
You have 4 children under 10 and a successful career only to find that your brain tumour has returned more aggressively. Your doctor tells you to prepare for death. The emotional roller coaster is unimaginable. Kate's incredible story brings hope, stability and humility to a precariously dangerous situation. For most of her life Kate was a 'giver' and 'receiving' didn't come easily. A brain tumour is a tough teacher.
Thank you to the Quest for Life foundation for assistance in this episode. If you need help or can volunteer or donate please visit their website: https://questforlife.org.au/
Kate Szymanski, welcome to 'a patient story.'
Kate Szymansky:Thank you very much for having me, Daniel, I really appreciated the invitation.
Daniel Baden:You were diagnosed with a aggressive form of brain cancer, and given a short time to live, but here you are looking amazing. the listeners can't see you but you look amazing.
Kate Szymansky:You're very kind, there must have been vasoline on the lens. That's what we like.
Daniel Baden:You were first diagnosed in 2009, with an astrocytoma, which is a less aggressive form of brain cancer. And it was dealt with and how was it dealt with?
Kate Szymansky:Yeah, so that was 2009, Daniel and I had a surgery, I had a resection, it was removed. And I was really fortunate because it was in a very accessible area and a non eloquent area. So there wasn't a lot of, I guess, concern going in other then of course, there was a lot of concern with the thought of someone actually going into your brain. And I remember at that point, I was so concerned, or just frightened, fearful, the thought of someone, something happening to your brain and wondering whether that would change me as a person, there was a lot of fear around that. I remember that very distinctly. Yes. So at that point, we didn't know what the pathology was going to be. All we knew was that there was a tumor, they didn't know if it was going to be malignant, they don't didn't know how long it had been there, obviously, had never having had a brain scan before and MRI. So yes, but at that point, it was still very confronting to get the news that it was brain cancer. In 2009, my, I had four children and my youngest at that, at that stage were I had twin girls who were two and my eldest son was seven. So that was a huge shock in of itself, getting that news. And it took quite a long time to recover, I recall after that first surgery, and but I didn't have to have any treatment. So they felt confident that they were able to get some margin around the tumor that wasn't overly large and, and that no treatment post operation was required. But I was told at the time that it would come back, because that's how brain cancer works. And when it comes back, it comes back a higher grade. But I, I really think about how I reacted or reacted to that news. And I'm sort of one of those blindly optimistic people, that sometimes really works in my favor. And sometimes it doesn't. And so I was just, I just thought, you know what, this, this isn't, you know, it's not gonna be a problem, it won't be I'm, I'm different, I'm different, this isn't going to it's not going to come back again. And as a result of that, so it's sort of really put it really far out of my mind. But I guess the downside of that was what now looking back retrospectively, I see that that was a real red flag that I ignored completely, and didn't make any changes in my life at all at the time. If anything, I probably just got busier and more stressed.
Daniel Baden:How old were you at the time?
Kate Szymansky:So I was 38.
Daniel Baden:Okay, and you had four small children. And you also came from a executive, corporate type role.
Kate Szymansky:The first sort of, I guess the first half of my career was advertising, and then sort of delved into a little bit of marketing later. But it was, yeah, really high stress sort of environment. And at that point, between those years of the first tumor and the second tumor, I remember I was working at a particular agency, and it was, it was meant to be part time. But to be honest, it was really full time hours, I was doing a lot of after hours work, and obviously with four young children, trying to make sure that had a lot of balls in the air, making sure that nothing sort of fell through the cracks with them. So yeah, it was a lot it was a hell of a lot, actually.
Daniel Baden:But when you had the surgery for the first brain cancer, we had a brief conversation a little while ago, and you said that you didn't make any lifestyle or dietary changes, which did surprise me a little bit to be honest. And I'm just wondering, you know, why not? What was your mindset or your state of mind? And around that, because most people would go, Okay, I'm going to chill out a bit more. I'm going to drink more green products or whatever they do. Yeah. What was going on for you?
Kate Szymansky:Yeah. So Daniel, I think what I mentioned before about being super optimistic and positive, and sometimes, you know, sometimes that's great. But other times, it's not so good. And I think at that time, I, it's just sort of a way of being, I was always putting everyone else's needs ahead of my own. And that's really come back to bite me. Actually.
Daniel Baden:The mother syndrome.
Kate Szymansky:That's right there mother syndrome, but actually times 1000. Okay. Just when I know it's sort of, I guess, the way of my way of being, I guess, I've done a lot of work since then on that. Yes. So I think that was my mind. My mindset was, okay, the doctors have told me that, but that's not going to happen to me. So I think I just felt like head in the sand. I just thought, if I put if I just put that to the side, I won't have to worry about it. It's not going to happen to me. I'll just keep going. Like I always do. Just keep going. Keep going, keep going.
Daniel Baden:Yeah,soldier on.
Kate Szymansky:Oh, yes.
Daniel Baden:But then it came back in 2012. And it was diagnosed as a grade 4 glioblastoma. And that's a fairly serious diagnosis, you were given 18 months to live. And that's gotta be something, especially when you got a small family that must just knock you out of the ballpark? How did you feel?
Kate Szymansky:Ah, Daniel, it was, I can't, I can't even express how devastating that news is. I mean, I just remember, it was awful. I remember looking into a mirror, in the in being in my car on the way home from the hospital. And looking into it, I was in the passenger seat and looking into that mirror and just sort of not believing that it could be true. And then I would wake up each morning and you know, that moment where you don't you sort of forget that anything's happened that blissful moment, and then literally be assaulted with that sense of complete hopelessness, and desperation for my kids. You know, when you've got children, I think your mortality really no longer has anything to do with you. It's just about them. And the the feeling of them growing up without their mother was just too much to bear. So I yeah, I was absolutely devastated.
Daniel Baden:Do you make a decision to try to explain to your children what's happening? Or do you well, for why around it
Kate Szymansky:at that point, I mean, they were pretty young. So Max, my eldest was only he was only 10. And the youngest, my twin girls, they were only five. So we actually got some really great advice from Petrea King, actually, who is a mentor of mine now. But at the time, my ex had met her at a conference. And she, she was just incredible. When we found out this is even before we actually got that diagnosis. So before the surgery, we just knew it was going to be pretty bad. But from I'd been to the doctor got the scan results on the Friday, and I was literally going in that Monday for the surgery. And so over that weekend, I remember having some conversations with Petrea on the phone, I'd never met her before, and just trying to get a sense of how to, you know, what do we tell the kids, what's sort of appropriate for them. And very much the advice at that time was, which I think is spot on, you know, even at any age, kids get a sense that, you know, they really understand they get a sense of what's happening, and when something really distressing is happening. And so if you sort of hide or try and hide conversations from them, I guess it makes them feel like they're not important enough in your life to know what's happening with they're hearing conversations that you're having with other people. So as much as possible, just being completely open and honest with them. But certainly not telling them anything that was distressing for them, like you don't then sort of project forward and, and give them you know, sort of statistics or anything like that. Because I really believe no one is no one can tell anyone how much longer they've got left on this planet who knows what none of us know. So I find that interesting that medical practitioners feel like they should tell people how much how much longer they've got, I never wanted to know, actually and I went out of my way not to know. But yeah,
Daniel Baden:so how did you find out then?
Kate Szymansky:Well, it was, it was, it was quite devastating, really because I had actually I made a real effort not to know I didn't look anything up. And my neurosurgeon invited me to this particular evening, and I thought it was going to be about sort of good news. They were talking about brain cancer where it's at at this point, and I was thinking, Oh, great. I'm gonna hear some good news about new treatments and find out what the lay of The land is, and this was I'm not quite sure how long this was post operation, but I guess it's probably, I'd say within maybe the first year within that first 12 months. And it was basically a presentation, talking about mortality rates and talking about how, basically, they're getting nowhere with the treatment. And it was all doom and gloom. And I was looking at this PowerPoint presentation, just thinking, I felt so blindsided by it. And I was really, really upset by it. So much so that I sent a very strongly worded email. Because, yeah, it was I, they, and they sort of knew my position, and I was quite disappointed by that.
Daniel Baden:Yeah, I understand. Just going back to your kids for a second, you had a adult conversation with your young children. And I imagined that you may have had some sort of expectation or inclination as to how they may have responded. Was that met? I mean, how were they?
Kate Szymansky:When it's sort of hard to know, Daniel, when I think back to those times, I mean, I'm, I'm a very tactile person, and hopefully quite a warm person. So I would have wrapped them up, I would have, you know, the love would have just been expressed continually. And it would just would have been a lot of reassurance. Like just that we're doing everything we can to get to get mommy better. And nothing really more than that. And, and the good thing is, I really didn't ask the hard questions. Because I think because there were so young, which is was a blessing in disguise. Really?
Daniel Baden:Yeah. Look, it's an important conversation, because so many people don't know how to manage their children with a terrible diagnosis. So
Kate Szymansky:lately, no, I think it's, I would just really encourage people Yeah, to, to have those conversations to ask your children how they're going. I know a lot more now than I did back then. And, and honestly, if I went through this again, I would do it very differently. A different person now to who I was 11. Yeah, more knowledge and wisdom around it as well.
Daniel Baden:We'll get onto that in a minute. Because that sounds very interesting. Your husband met Petrea King at a conference and introduced you to portray it. Now I'm just gonna give Petrea a free plug here. She doesn't know this. But I love Patricia King, she is a hero of mine. And I've never met a kinder, more genuine individual. She's a naturopath, a nurse, I think, and just has a way of managing and dealing with people like I've never met anyone. She runs a foundation called the quest for Life Foundation
(https://questforlife.org.au/), which I know has helped many of my patients in the past, and friends as well. And not just the patient helps the whole family deal with some terrible situations. If anyone out there listening would like to get involved, please get in touch with the quest for Life Foundation. If you have some spare cash, and you'd like to benefit people in the future, or even in the very near future, please make a donation to Quest for life. And I just think it's just one of the best things you can do for humanity. That was my free plug. She didn't know. But let's go on.
Kate Szymansky:Daniel, and as you know, I now do facilitation and counseling for quest for life as well. So you know, I can't sing betrays pay is praises more loudly and clearly. And yes, please anyone who can donate because the foundation doesn't like to turn anyone away on financial grounds. So when people donate, it just means that many more people have access to this education program, which is is life changing? I mean, I can change my life.
Daniel Baden:Yeah, yeah. Good. Well, I'll put a link to the foundation on the chat notes after this. So you were exposed to Petrea and you you did the one week program there. Yeah. What is the one week program? What's it all about?
Kate Szymansky:Well, there's three different programs, Daniel, but the one that I did with my husband at the time was called is called quest. It's just called Quest for life. And that particular five day program is very much sort of directed towards those people going through life threatening illnesses. That's what it's a little bit more sort of focused on. I guess, sort of the practical side of that people going through cancer, chronic illness, whereas the other two programs, one called healing your life, and one called Moving Beyond trauma, and MBT moving beyond beyond trauma is very much for those dealing with post traumatic stress and healing your life is for everything else really. For people deal. linguish major challenges mental health challenges, people going through grief, they've gone through a really messy divorce, whatever their massive challenge is, that's what that third program sort of is for everyone else. So they're the three programs. And so the quest for Life program that I went on, and that I experienced it, it was profound. And this is at a time where I was waking up with no hope. And thinking I'm, I'm done here. And I walked away from that program really changed and having a sense of hope, for the first time since I got that news. And the reason I had hope was because it was explained to me very clearly, that I had quite a lot of agency in this much more than I thought in terms of control over what was happening. And that's all about understanding your internal and external environment, and essentially creating the most conducive environment for healing. So there's some really, really practical information that you learn there, and really easy to understand and easy to apply to your life immediately
Daniel Baden:give you one example of what that might have been for you. Well, I
Kate Szymansky:things like meditation, and how incredibly helpful it is in terms of, because when you think about your distress around something like this, the distress is what's happening up here, I'm pointing at my head, in my mind, that's where the pain is, that's where the anguish is. And what meditation is all about is being able to observe those thoughts and all the feelings associated with those thoughts, and be able to witness them as opposed to being overwhelmed and enmeshed by those feelings. And having a sense that that's all there is you become those overwhelming feelings. So meditation wasn't was just was really made an enormous difference for me in terms of dealing with with what I was dealing with. But other practical things were things like having fresh juices, for example, and what sort of impact that can have, particularly when you're going through chemo and radiation therapy. So just nutrition, there's a lot around nutrition. That whole understanding that when it comes to what we put on ourselves, what we eat, everything that's in that interstitial fluid that's surrounding all of our cells, understanding that the chemistry of our emotions is one of those things as well. And so understanding then how essential it or not essential, but important it is to try and manage the stressors in our life and try and encourage a lot of laughter, some lightness, because that essentially is what we're what we are surrounding ourselves in. And whatever dis ease in the body, whatever is whatever gene might be there, whether that gene expresses or doesn't express has everything to do with this, what's surrounding that cell, which is the interstitial fluid. And we have a lot of agency, we have a lot of control around what that environment looks like. And that is really practical information that I learned. And that was a game changer,
Daniel Baden:you know, to reinforce everything you've just said a couple of months ago, I interviewed Charlie Teo, who's a well known brain surgeon for a podcast, who the patient he was talking about also had a glioblastoma, and the gentleman was on the podcast, but the gentleman lived a wild life, let's say drinking and womanizing and eating badly and all that sort of stuff. And when he stopped all that the glioblastoma shrunk and almost went away. And after a few years, the gentleman said, I had enough of this I want to go drinking in boozing and whatever, smoking again, and then also to come back again. And I I just thought that was amazing. And it reinforces everything you've just spoken about. Yeah.
Kate Szymansky:Yeah. Fascinating. Play. It's yeah, that is it's really accurate. I do but I in saying that I still think that their balance is necessary. Because I do remember when I was first diagnosed, just doing everything to the letter, getting rid of all sugar out of my diet, getting rid of alcohol, getting rid of coffee, and I remember mum saying to me, darling, you know, it's maybe that's just a bit too much at this point, you know, you're dealing with so much right now. It's, it's so it's those, like going out for you with your friends and having a coffee, that connection is actually more important than anything else. And I absolutely understand that now knowing what I know. And, you know, I'm actually not surprisingly quite interested in neuroscience these days and, and understanding that social connection is one of the biggest things to support neuroplasticity. That's really good for our brain health. So it's I think it's obvious See, you can go really hardcore. But I do think you've got to have some really nice things what we were talking about before the chemistry of our emotions, we want to feel happy. We want to feel joyful. We want to, we want to laugh. We want to have
Daniel Baden:that from connecting with other human beings. Yeah,
Kate Szymansky:absolutely. And nature and nature. That's a big one for me.
Daniel Baden:Absolutely. It is lots of evidence behind nature and serious diseases. Well, what happened? You have this diagnosis you went to Petrea, you did the course. I presume you still have the tumor.What did you do?
Kate Szymansky:No the tumor was removed. So I had the surgery. And then we got the pathology back. So they were able, I was very lucky, it had grown back in exactly the same place. And they were able to remove it. So I was removed. But even with it removed, I was still had the diet, that prognosis of 18 months, because the way that brain cancer works is there's always said it satellite cells all throughout the brain. That's that is normally how things work. So I did the what they call the gold standard treatment here in Australia, and that is chemotherapy and radiation therapy. And I also went on a trial, which Yeah, was that that was a whole nother thing as well, which meant I had to be because normally with brain cancer, you have oral chemotherapy. Normally Tramadol, I think is the agent. And I went on to a trial that were that was infusion. So it meant that I was in the hospital in their chemo ward for two days, every week. And that ended up being so depressing. So in the end with that, with the actual trial, I made the decision to actually pull out of the trial because I felt like if potentially it was doing any good, the negative impact of actually being in the chemo ward two days a week far outweighed any possible positive positive effect it could have on me
Daniel Baden:what was actually the part that affected you mostly,
Kate Szymansky:I tried to, I tried to make it a really positive experience, I'd always have someone one of my really good friends with me, we'd watch something fun. But I think just that environment, there's so many sad people there. And it always took so much longer than it was meant to. And so you were there for hours and hours and hours and hours. There's nothing really light about It's really heavy. Yeah, really heavy energy that you're sitting in. Because you're not just you're not just there, in your own energy. You're there with all of these other people that feel really hopeless, and feeling and feeling really unwell. And, and many of them, there's just a lot of heavy energy in that ward.
Daniel Baden:So just in case there's a hospital administrator listening to this podcast, if you had it in the garden, or
Kate Szymansky:oh, man, that would be absolute. That would be phenomenal. I've never thought about that being out in. Absolutely. Because we know and one thing I did try and do as much as I could, Daniel with both the chemo and with the radiation therapy was very much thinking, okay, and accepting this, this is helping me seeing it not as poisoned seeing it as life giving, because I think those visualizations are really important as well. So if you were outdoors, just imagine how much easier would be to do that, to really reframe that as this is a life giving something life giving that is entering my body right now. And I am welcoming it every cell in my body is welcoming this into my body to heal. I mean, that's a very, very different visualization right there, isn't it?
Daniel Baden:Absolutely. So at some point, you've got yourself involved with a particular type of therapy, which I'm extremely interested in, because I've seen some people have amazing outcomes. And that is dendritic cell therapy. Yes. Could you talk to us about that?
Kate Szymansky:Sure. So I'm definitely not a scientist, but I'll explain it in my very layman terms. So this this was really new back when in 2013. When we went over to Germany,
Daniel Baden:it's still not a thing in Australia, by the way.
Kate Szymansky:No, it isn't. You're right. It's not available here, which is ridiculous. But many more people have know about it. And and back then I didn't know anyone who had done it. But my partner then he did a lot of research. And he found he came across a professor Julian Barden, who was working with bio SEPTA at the time. I don't know if he still is, and he developed the antigen or the chemotherapeutic that had the ability to target tumor cells and tumor cells only rather than napalm in all the cells. which is what you know, traditional chemotherapy does. So he here in Australia with FDA regulations, it takes, you know, 20 years of trials, clinical trials to actually get anything through. So recognizing that he wouldn't be able to get this administered in Australia, he had a relationship with a doctor by the name of Dr. Thomas Nestle hooked over in Germany. And he created this this type of therapy called dendritic cell therapy, which is a type of immunotherapy. So, with this therapy, they harvest your white blood cells, so my white blood cells they harvested, and then using that chemotherapeutic that Julian Barden had developed, they create a vaccine. So using my white blood cells, and then essentially you are mobilizing your own immune system to do the job that it hasn't done when it comes to tumor cells, because they're like immortal cells that that don't die. Every cell is meant to die. And yeah, so that's how the immunotherapy works.
Daniel Baden:And that was one little component to it. Yeah, is that when they extract dendritic cells, or they isolate them from your own blood, and they also take some tumor cells as well. And so they expose the tumor to your own dendritic cells and potentized that mixture. So you've got these supercharged dendritic cells that really know what your tumor looks like. And so they have a real good crack at attacking it. And that's, and I think that's the key to it really simulates what are called T cells in the blood and destroy good evidence for it. Yeah, overseas. There's a couple of trials going on in Australia. But we haven't seen it clinically available generally yet. Very slow.
Kate Szymansky:I recall. There's someone but was it Kevin Hart? Was that his name? I thought he was the chap here in Australia, who was trying to get it up and running originally.
Daniel Baden:At university to Queensland is one I believe, and there's another one that the Peter Mac center in Victoria, I think they're also running a trial, if I remember correctly. Yeah, but one day, because it does sound pretty good, especially with a lot of the natural medicine stuff that we talk about, it seems to be augmented by good diet and lifestyle choices and some supplements and that sort of thing. So it's interesting.
Kate Szymansky:I guess the not to bring a downer on that, Daniel. But the I guess the hard part of getting this through will be the fact trying to get pharmaceutical companies on board, because if there's not a one size fits all the fact that this is customized for each individual, whether or not they're going to make enough money out of that will become the issue and become the potential barrier.
Daniel Baden:Yeah, look, you never know. Yeah, we there's lots of stuff that happens, I'm sure behind closed doors that we're never exposed to.
Kate Szymansky:Yes, we just gotta cross our fingers that Yeah. As you say it's it can it can be incredibly effective. And but I mean, to be honest, whether I'm still here as a result of that, who knows? And I guess who cares? Really, the fact is, I'm still here, and I've done plenty of things to try and ensure that I am.
Daniel Baden:So you had to go to Germany, though, to get this done. The stress on financially that must just be beyond the reach of most people, the impact it has on the kids and who looks after the kids and runs the house and give them to school? And how did you manage all of that? How long did you have to go for,
Kate Szymansky:or we had to go had to go for? I had to go for five, five to six months, because the way that the initial treatment is sort of sheduled you need to be there. It's not arduous at all. The actual treatment, nothing like chemo here, it's literally so simple. You could have it all done in one day. But the way that the treatment had been working, you needed to have those injections consecutively monthly for those first five months. And so yeah, we were not financially in a good place at all at that time. So some friends of mine really encouraged me to say yes to a fundraiser, which I really struggled with. It was so hard to say yes. And when I eventually said yes.
Daniel Baden:Why was it hard to say yes.
Kate Szymansky:You know, because I'm not I wasn't used to receiving you know, like, I help I'm the one who helps other people. And that's, you know, again, that's something this is my life lesson. I'm still learning it. I'm still learning it receiving is giving, receiving is giving and it is I get that because If you don't allow that, then you're robbing somebody else of the opportunity to feel really good about helping you. But it's a hard lesson to learn. So, my friends wanted to do a do a fundraiser. And when I, when I eventually acquiesced and said, you know, yes, because there was no other way. I mean, it was silly that I was even contemplating not saying yes, and this is way before the days of, you know, on what are they on Facebook, how they do for me, you know, there was like that. So this is Yeah, sort of wait a bit way back before any of that was happening. And in my head, I'm thinking our backyard barbecue, you know, I don't know. Anyhow, as it turned out, this group of people or friends and some family, and my ex, they created this group. And they did such an a magnificent job. And they, it ended up being a an 800 person event, which I sort of can't even believe now. Beautiful Mary khusus was the emcee, the baby animals were there playing. It was crazy. And there was all these amazing, this is massive. What is it called when they sell things? A raffle? Yeah, an auction auction. Auction. They had this incredible auction that all these people had had given they had given us the most incredible sort of things to auction off. Gosh, my I'm losing my words. But it was, yeah, it's it. Even now, it can bring me to tears, the thought of so much love in this room, and so much love for me. And incredible, you know, when you're alive to witness that sort of love, you know, just, they desperately wanted to help me and wanted to help my family and get us over to Germany. And they also want understood that it really wasn't going to work. If we weren't all together, like there's no way I could, I wasn't well enough to be going flying back and forth six times and be away from my kids and my family for that long each time. This is no way that would have just couldn't, that wouldn't work at all. So this allowed us the six of us to, to like we took the kids out of school, we did distance education with them. And we sort of moved around to a few different places where there was sort of friends or family or family. Yeah, and each time just keep coming back to Germany to daanish that where the clinic was where that dendritic cell therapy was offered.
Daniel Baden:Imagine how hard it was for someone like you to actually recognize that you are actually worthy.
Kate Szymansky:Yes. Goodness, Daniel. Yes. Spot on spot on. Yeah. And I'm still working at it.
Daniel Baden:You know, there are so many lessons in life. And one of them is that you're here now to help other people.
Kate Szymansky:That's right. Absolutely.
Daniel Baden:Right, you're giving back. It's wonderful.
Kate Szymansky:No, no, no, no, that's my life's work now. And that, no, for me, that's really makes sense of why I'm still here, Daniel, I'm still here for a reason, not only just to, obviously, for my children, but because I do I want you know, I'm hoping there's something here there's some sort of wisdom, something that can help other people when they're dealing with massive challenge themselves.
Daniel Baden:I know that you sought many different types of modalities and therapies, acupuncture, Chinese herbs, yoga, meditation, etc. Had you come across all this stuff before? It just wasn't so new to you? And were you accepting of it all?
Kate Szymansky:I was very accepting. No, I'd been into that stuff. Which was great. Because I was very well positioned. There was no skepticism whatsoever with me, I sort of go the opposite way. I'm i i sort of, in some ways, I'm, is it too dumb to can be too trusting? I sort of, yeah, but I'm very open, very, very open. So there was no issue whatsoever. I was already I probably with the acupuncture. probably hadn't done acupuncture before. But I'd certainly been to naturopaths before, you know, I'd been into meditation before. Yes, I was very as pretty open to pretty much everything. That's
Daniel Baden:why, if you could put this into a few words, how have you as a person changed? What have you seen that's different about yourself? And perhaps what would you tell your younger self now?
Kate Szymansky:Well, I think going back to that self worth thing that you mentioned as well, I think I would, well, I'd tell my younger self a few things. I would certainly let them know that they're absolutely worthy. And I would hopefully give them more of a voice in terms of expressing why they need, what I need. And I think I would just encourage more curiosity around who I am, and why I am like I am. And try and get really clear on those sort of unconscious beliefs that you take on as a very young person that be sort of operating out of completely unconsciously. And I would really encourage that, that sort of work on yourself to just to understand myself a little bit better. But yeah, just just bring more curiosity to things, I would say just question things a little bit more overarching advice, I'd give my younger self, and also just understand the impact of stress, the impact of going too hard in life, and, and just missing a lot of things. And understanding of that impact on on the body. And the DIS ease that happens as a result of that would be my advice as well.
Daniel Baden:You've embraced everything you've learned. And you look, you really do look healthy and amazing. And you've obviously have continued to embrace it. And now you're is the word facilitator or instructor with portraying?
Kate Szymansky:Yes, yeah. For you. So me and another facilitator, we teach the program. So on five day programs were there to teach. But the reason why I think these programs work so spectacularly Daniel is, everyone's there together, there's no, the whole team shares, everyone shares, what they're going through their challenges. So there's no sense of us and them, there's just a real sense of community, everyone there, being there experiencing similar things, and learning from each other. And it's a really, it's the transformation that I've witnessed from Monday to Friday, over and over and over is extraordinary. Extraordinary,
Daniel Baden:isn't just for the individuals with the diagnosis or do their families come in with them, sometimes,
Kate Szymansky:I think it's ideal for the partner, spouse or you know, a partner to come, partners to come together, we don't have facilities for children there at the moment, we're not able to run children's programs, hopefully, maybe down the track one day, but certainly to be there with your partner, because you're, it's really hard to explain otherwise. And and if you're there together, you sort of walk away with a common sort of language, a common, I guess, goal, or common understanding of where you can go from here. And I've also, as a result of going through what I've what I've gone through and the result of doing the work at Quest for being involved with them for such a long time. Now, you start out volunteering, and then you do second support, and then you do sort of support role. And then you can train as a facilitator. And in the last I've in I just went back to uni full time and did a counseling diploma. So now I'm I'm a counselor, as well as a facilitator. And yeah, it's I love it, I love to be able to, to be there for other people and to help them and have some sense of, I guess it's I feel blessed in many ways that I've experienced something like this. And it really, you know, I guess for me, I love I feel like I can really make an enormous difference for other people dealing with things like cancer, having walked in their shoes before, totally understanding what that feels like to face your mortality. It's really hard to understand unless you've been there before and and so I just love the fact that I can bring that to other people when they're dealing with such massive challenge
Daniel Baden:will both says absolutely critical. So other people get in touch with you or quiz for my posts, what's the best way forward?
Kate Szymansky:Well, thank you for giving the quest for life, the website in just look up, you know, just Google quest for life, and they'll come up straightaway, I can't recommend recommend those weeks more highly to anyone going through any sort of challenge. And really, to be honest, that education is so relevant to every person on the planet. It's because it's not about not dying. It's about living well. Everyone could could do with with that sort of recipe, couldn't they? Because the whole program really is about portrays it's called the recipe for peace, and who doesn't want a little bit more peace in their lives, and it's all about navigating challenge more skillfully and more peacefully as well. So there's that and you can find me on my website, which is Kate szymanski.com.au. So that's Szymanski. For anyone looking for a counselor
Daniel Baden:will Kate you have just been amazing and very encouraging and honest sending you lots of love. I hope you can accept it.
Kate Szymansky:Thank you. I do and I've sent much love back to you, Daniel. I love doing this podcast. It's amazing. And I really hope that it helps a lot of people no doubt it has helped many so far. So thank you for what you're doing. It's incredible.
Daniel Baden:It's a lot of fun. I've got to tell you, I'm learning so much.
Kate Szymansky:You're teaching. Thank you for you told me something about dendritic cell therapy today that I didn't know so well, thank you.
Daniel Baden:But look, stay in touch and and wishing you all the best. Take care.
Kate Szymansky:Thank you, Daniel. Take care. Bye